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	<title>Comments on: Unnatural Approach to Diabetes</title>
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	<link>http://www.sciencebase.com/science-blog/unnatural-approach-to-diabetes.html</link>
	<description>Science Blog from Freelance Science Writer David Bradley</description>
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		<title>By: Mulberry for Weight Loss: Not just unproven, but implausible &#171; Science-Based Pharmacy</title>
		<link>http://www.sciencebase.com/science-blog/unnatural-approach-to-diabetes.html/comment-page-5#comment-630462</link>
		<dc:creator>Mulberry for Weight Loss: Not just unproven, but implausible &#171; Science-Based Pharmacy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 27 May 2009 03:30:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sciencebase.com/science-blog/?p=1708#comment-630462</guid>
		<description>[...] Another mulberry-based health product was discussed by David Bradley on his excellent blog, Sciencebase. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Another mulberry-based health product was discussed by David Bradley on his excellent blog, Sciencebase. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: chuck</title>
		<link>http://www.sciencebase.com/science-blog/unnatural-approach-to-diabetes.html/comment-page-5#comment-628916</link>
		<dc:creator>chuck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Apr 2009 03:04:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sciencebase.com/science-blog/?p=1708#comment-628916</guid>
		<description>i have higher levels of sugar, i have been chewing regular gum and using throat lozenges that have sugar, i have been eating potato chips that have too much sodium, i have medication that has all kinds of side effects, to include diarrhea, aren&#039;t there any fruits and vegetables that can restore a normal blood sugar level</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i have higher levels of sugar, i have been chewing regular gum and using throat lozenges that have sugar, i have been eating potato chips that have too much sodium, i have medication that has all kinds of side effects, to include diarrhea, aren&#8217;t there any fruits and vegetables that can restore a normal blood sugar level</p>
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		<title>By: David Bradley</title>
		<link>http://www.sciencebase.com/science-blog/unnatural-approach-to-diabetes.html/comment-page-4#comment-542465</link>
		<dc:creator>David Bradley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Sep 2008 08:30:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sciencebase.com/science-blog/?p=1708#comment-542465</guid>
		<description>Thanks for sharing Greg, very interesting story. Of course, you could have picked the &quot;wrong&quot; herbal at some point and poisoned yourself, but then again, that can happen with a prescribed drug too...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for sharing Greg, very interesting story. Of course, you could have picked the &#8220;wrong&#8221; herbal at some point and poisoned yourself, but then again, that can happen with a prescribed drug too&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Greg Charlton</title>
		<link>http://www.sciencebase.com/science-blog/unnatural-approach-to-diabetes.html/comment-page-4#comment-542424</link>
		<dc:creator>Greg Charlton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Sep 2008 07:32:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sciencebase.com/science-blog/?p=1708#comment-542424</guid>
		<description>I am firmly against bringing herbals and alternative medicines under any &quot;pharma&quot; umbrella where possible remedies languish unavailable pending definitive studies which wait to be made in spite of lack of funds.

Willow bark extract, the precursor of aspirin, is still marketed separately with the caveat that the claims made for it were not approved by the FDA. Gallega officinalis, or goat&#039;s rue, is the herb from which the #1 Diabetes-2 medication, Metformin, has been developed, but no one can buy goat&#039;s rue except from the very sites accused of quackery by promoting folk medicines. This is not to say that all promoted supplements have real worth, far from it -- and there will always be those whose consumption is predicated on hearsay and the desire for quick, no-hassle remedies that require no deviation from the poor diets and excerise-poor lifestyles adopted by the majority. (And I daresay we all know some health-food addicts that wax eloquent on the benfits of this or that while looking no more healthy than the next person.) 

When first diagnosed with Diabetes-2, I was put on Metformin 850 mg and Enalapril Maleate 2.5 mg and given a glucose-monitoring meter. I was told to avoid the usual: sweets, starches, certain fruits, etc. and to adopt an exercise program (no details - left up to me). I weighed 210 lbs. 

For six months I lived with diarrhea and depression, though the restricted diet and the exercise took off 15 lbs. The doctor claimed he wasn&#039;t happy with the blood sugar levels and increased the metformin to 1350 mg. A cholesterol-lowering medication was prescribed as well, but I never filled it. 

To shorten the narrative, I threw out all the medications and started using the antidiabetic herbs and supplements I found on the Internet, very few of which are &quot;FDA approved&quot;.

Of course, cinnamon and fenugreek aren&#039;t going to be condemned anytime soon by the FDA or anyone else, but the same isn&#039;t true of some of the others.

Using my glucose monitor I was able to find out which ones worked and which ones didn&#039;t, that simply. Now I weigh 20 lbs less (175) and the diarrhea and depression are over. The last blood test showed normal blood pressure, cholesterol, triglycerides, glyco-hemoglobin and blood glucose levels. The only downside was the cash outlay that made it possible - more expensive than the co-payments shelled out for the prescription meds.

I&#039;ve also found that my body doesn&#039;t give up when I accidentally leave the supplements at home; i.e., after regular use of the supplements, a &quot;miss&quot; every now and then did not cause blood sugar to spike after a meal - like it did when I forgot the Metformin. I&#039;m grateful to the &quot;Health Food&quot; companies online that made it possible. The doctor initially did not approve, but now with three good blood tests in a row over the last nine months, he just says &quot;keep doing whatever you&#039;re doing&quot;. And what I&#039;m doing is what would not have been possible if some regulatory agency had interfered with my freedom to experiment with herbs and - yes - chemical supplements like chromium picolinate.

True, I haven&#039;t been on this current regimen for years and years to know whether the good results have any preventative effect on diabetes complications like limb death, neuropathy, detached retina, heart or kidney failure, etc. On the other hand, many of those with amputated limbs and diabetes-indiced blindness or coronaries were faithfully taking their FDA-approved insulin or oral medications.right up to the sad events.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am firmly against bringing herbals and alternative medicines under any &#8220;pharma&#8221; umbrella where possible remedies languish unavailable pending definitive studies which wait to be made in spite of lack of funds.</p>
<p>Willow bark extract, the precursor of aspirin, is still marketed separately with the caveat that the claims made for it were not approved by the FDA. Gallega officinalis, or goat&#8217;s rue, is the herb from which the #1 Diabetes-2 medication, Metformin, has been developed, but no one can buy goat&#8217;s rue except from the very sites accused of quackery by promoting folk medicines. This is not to say that all promoted supplements have real worth, far from it &#8212; and there will always be those whose consumption is predicated on hearsay and the desire for quick, no-hassle remedies that require no deviation from the poor diets and excerise-poor lifestyles adopted by the majority. (And I daresay we all know some health-food addicts that wax eloquent on the benfits of this or that while looking no more healthy than the next person.) </p>
<p>When first diagnosed with Diabetes-2, I was put on Metformin 850 mg and Enalapril Maleate 2.5 mg and given a glucose-monitoring meter. I was told to avoid the usual: sweets, starches, certain fruits, etc. and to adopt an exercise program (no details &#8211; left up to me). I weighed 210 lbs. </p>
<p>For six months I lived with diarrhea and depression, though the restricted diet and the exercise took off 15 lbs. The doctor claimed he wasn&#8217;t happy with the blood sugar levels and increased the metformin to 1350 mg. A cholesterol-lowering medication was prescribed as well, but I never filled it. </p>
<p>To shorten the narrative, I threw out all the medications and started using the antidiabetic herbs and supplements I found on the Internet, very few of which are &#8220;FDA approved&#8221;.</p>
<p>Of course, cinnamon and fenugreek aren&#8217;t going to be condemned anytime soon by the FDA or anyone else, but the same isn&#8217;t true of some of the others.</p>
<p>Using my glucose monitor I was able to find out which ones worked and which ones didn&#8217;t, that simply. Now I weigh 20 lbs less (175) and the diarrhea and depression are over. The last blood test showed normal blood pressure, cholesterol, triglycerides, glyco-hemoglobin and blood glucose levels. The only downside was the cash outlay that made it possible &#8211; more expensive than the co-payments shelled out for the prescription meds.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve also found that my body doesn&#8217;t give up when I accidentally leave the supplements at home; i.e., after regular use of the supplements, a &#8220;miss&#8221; every now and then did not cause blood sugar to spike after a meal &#8211; like it did when I forgot the Metformin. I&#8217;m grateful to the &#8220;Health Food&#8221; companies online that made it possible. The doctor initially did not approve, but now with three good blood tests in a row over the last nine months, he just says &#8220;keep doing whatever you&#8217;re doing&#8221;. And what I&#8217;m doing is what would not have been possible if some regulatory agency had interfered with my freedom to experiment with herbs and &#8211; yes &#8211; chemical supplements like chromium picolinate.</p>
<p>True, I haven&#8217;t been on this current regimen for years and years to know whether the good results have any preventative effect on diabetes complications like limb death, neuropathy, detached retina, heart or kidney failure, etc. On the other hand, many of those with amputated limbs and diabetes-indiced blindness or coronaries were faithfully taking their FDA-approved insulin or oral medications.right up to the sad events.</p>
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		<title>By: David Bradley</title>
		<link>http://www.sciencebase.com/science-blog/unnatural-approach-to-diabetes.html/comment-page-4#comment-488448</link>
		<dc:creator>David Bradley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jul 2008 17:11:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sciencebase.com/science-blog/?p=1708#comment-488448</guid>
		<description>Ah, but what about those people taking a daily dose of some particular herbal to stop them getting one disease and repeatedly banging their organs (particularly liver and heart) with a compound that is not safe in its unmetabolised form. The case in point is related to your cranberry example and concerns grapefruit juice and an old antihistamine Triludan. Admittedly, one would have to have drunk an awful lot of grapefruit juice for the Triludan to remain unmetabolised long enough to cause heart damage. However, my point is that many herbals are concentrated versions of such products and so popping a daily pill might provide the equivalent of several glasses of the drink, which could quite easily interfere with a prescribed drug.

A person prescribed antidepressants might imagine that taking St John&#039;s Wort alongside would be safe and helpful. It most likely wouldn&#039;t be, especially if they also have thyroid problems. The fact that there is a serious disconnect between herbals and pharma products could be lethal in some cases, which is why I think there should be better controls.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ah, but what about those people taking a daily dose of some particular herbal to stop them getting one disease and repeatedly banging their organs (particularly liver and heart) with a compound that is not safe in its unmetabolised form. The case in point is related to your cranberry example and concerns grapefruit juice and an old antihistamine Triludan. Admittedly, one would have to have drunk an awful lot of grapefruit juice for the Triludan to remain unmetabolised long enough to cause heart damage. However, my point is that many herbals are concentrated versions of such products and so popping a daily pill might provide the equivalent of several glasses of the drink, which could quite easily interfere with a prescribed drug.</p>
<p>A person prescribed antidepressants might imagine that taking St John&#8217;s Wort alongside would be safe and helpful. It most likely wouldn&#8217;t be, especially if they also have thyroid problems. The fact that there is a serious disconnect between herbals and pharma products could be lethal in some cases, which is why I think there should be better controls.</p>
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		<title>By: Mina</title>
		<link>http://www.sciencebase.com/science-blog/unnatural-approach-to-diabetes.html/comment-page-4#comment-488425</link>
		<dc:creator>Mina</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jul 2008 16:49:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sciencebase.com/science-blog/?p=1708#comment-488425</guid>
		<description>No, I&#039;ll go back to bladder infections as an example.  This is a bit of a deviation from herbals but there is research suggesting that cranberries are useful for preventing bladder infections.  Key word is prevention.  Once an infection has taken root, no sane doctor is going to recommend cranberry extract or juice.  Rather, antibiotics are standard treatment.

To reiterate, I&#039;m not arguing that they should not be regulated.  In fact, I&#039;m a huge supporter of increased regulations AND training for anyone who provides information on these types of products.  Right now, it&#039;s far too relaxed and pardon my language but some of the &#039;advice&#039; provided along with purchases is daft at best (speaking from personal experience on that one).  What I am saying is that pharmaceuticals are far more potentially onerous as a comparative whole and that it seems excessive to subject herbals to the exact same scrutiny and testing.  I think a separate category is realistic and would be effective, plus safer than the current wishy washy pseudo-regulations around most herbals.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No, I&#8217;ll go back to bladder infections as an example.  This is a bit of a deviation from herbals but there is research suggesting that cranberries are useful for preventing bladder infections.  Key word is prevention.  Once an infection has taken root, no sane doctor is going to recommend cranberry extract or juice.  Rather, antibiotics are standard treatment.</p>
<p>To reiterate, I&#8217;m not arguing that they should not be regulated.  In fact, I&#8217;m a huge supporter of increased regulations AND training for anyone who provides information on these types of products.  Right now, it&#8217;s far too relaxed and pardon my language but some of the &#8216;advice&#8217; provided along with purchases is daft at best (speaking from personal experience on that one).  What I am saying is that pharmaceuticals are far more potentially onerous as a comparative whole and that it seems excessive to subject herbals to the exact same scrutiny and testing.  I think a separate category is realistic and would be effective, plus safer than the current wishy washy pseudo-regulations around most herbals.</p>
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		<title>By: David Bradley</title>
		<link>http://www.sciencebase.com/science-blog/unnatural-approach-to-diabetes.html/comment-page-4#comment-487984</link>
		<dc:creator>David Bradley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jul 2008 07:32:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sciencebase.com/science-blog/?p=1708#comment-487984</guid>
		<description>Mina, but I guess that&#039;s the point. If these herbals aren&#039;t active then why are they being sold? If they&#039;re  inactive, then they&#039;re nothing more than placebos, they&#039;re like a crutch for someone with perfectly good legs.

&quot;commonly used as preventative an supportive treatments alongside pharmaceuticals&quot;, sorry but that really just sounds like an evidence-free proposition.

I&#039;m not saying that all herbals are hogwash, some do have physiological effects and because they do, they should be regulated properly. Take St John&#039;s Wort, anyone who feels a bit miserable can buy it OTC and start popping pills in the hope of making themselves better, totally unaware of its latent interactions with certain medications, often made by the same companies via their pharma wing:

http://www.intelihealth.com/IH/ihtIH/WSIHW000/8513/31402/348539.html

More to the point, herbal manufacturers are not allowed to make medical claims about herbal products, so consumers buy these things blindly or having read some anecdotal evidence in lifestyle magazines of non-controlled, non-blinded, quasi clinical trials.

Like I said before, if they have no effects, then they&#039;re a waste of money, if they do have effects then these should be regulated because the effects could be hazardous when mixed with other diseases and pharma products.

Which mainstream herbals do you think are worthy? Echinacea? Ginseng? Maluka honey? None of those have any proven efficacy beyond acting as a poor source of some vitamins and minerals.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mina, but I guess that&#8217;s the point. If these herbals aren&#8217;t active then why are they being sold? If they&#8217;re  inactive, then they&#8217;re nothing more than placebos, they&#8217;re like a crutch for someone with perfectly good legs.</p>
<p>&#8220;commonly used as preventative an supportive treatments alongside pharmaceuticals&#8221;, sorry but that really just sounds like an evidence-free proposition.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not saying that all herbals are hogwash, some do have physiological effects and because they do, they should be regulated properly. Take St John&#8217;s Wort, anyone who feels a bit miserable can buy it OTC and start popping pills in the hope of making themselves better, totally unaware of its latent interactions with certain medications, often made by the same companies via their pharma wing:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.intelihealth.com/IH/ihtIH/WSIHW000/8513/31402/348539.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.intelihealth.com/IH/ihtIH/WSIHW000/8513/31402/348539.html</a></p>
<p>More to the point, herbal manufacturers are not allowed to make medical claims about herbal products, so consumers buy these things blindly or having read some anecdotal evidence in lifestyle magazines of non-controlled, non-blinded, quasi clinical trials.</p>
<p>Like I said before, if they have no effects, then they&#8217;re a waste of money, if they do have effects then these should be regulated because the effects could be hazardous when mixed with other diseases and pharma products.</p>
<p>Which mainstream herbals do you think are worthy? Echinacea? Ginseng? Maluka honey? None of those have any proven efficacy beyond acting as a poor source of some vitamins and minerals.</p>
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		<title>By: Mina</title>
		<link>http://www.sciencebase.com/science-blog/unnatural-approach-to-diabetes.html/comment-page-3#comment-487972</link>
		<dc:creator>Mina</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jul 2008 07:08:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sciencebase.com/science-blog/?p=1708#comment-487972</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s not so black-and-white though.  The vast majority of herbal preparations aren&#039;t viewed to treat disease in the way that pharmaceuticals are presented nor are they presented as &#039;cure alls.&#039;  Sure, we all know the stories of dangerous herbs and dubious advertising but I don&#039;t think that warrants all mainstream herbal preparations being subject to the same testing required for pharmaceuticals.  Not only that, but the funding simply isn&#039;t there either, particularly given that the treatments don&#039;t have significant effects in the way pharma ones do (generalizing here, of course).  Consumers would not have access to many useful herbal preparations if the requirements were on par with pharmaceuticals.

I don&#039;t think that herbals are typically used as a &#039;cure&#039; in the same way that – for example – antibiotics might be used to treat a bladder infection.  Herbals are commonly used as preventative and supportive treatments alongside pharmaceuticals.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s not so black-and-white though.  The vast majority of herbal preparations aren&#8217;t viewed to treat disease in the way that pharmaceuticals are presented nor are they presented as &#8216;cure alls.&#8217;  Sure, we all know the stories of dangerous herbs and dubious advertising but I don&#8217;t think that warrants all mainstream herbal preparations being subject to the same testing required for pharmaceuticals.  Not only that, but the funding simply isn&#8217;t there either, particularly given that the treatments don&#8217;t have significant effects in the way pharma ones do (generalizing here, of course).  Consumers would not have access to many useful herbal preparations if the requirements were on par with pharmaceuticals.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t think that herbals are typically used as a &#8216;cure&#8217; in the same way that – for example – antibiotics might be used to treat a bladder infection.  Herbals are commonly used as preventative and supportive treatments alongside pharmaceuticals.</p>
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		<title>By: David Bradley</title>
		<link>http://www.sciencebase.com/science-blog/unnatural-approach-to-diabetes.html/comment-page-3#comment-487167</link>
		<dc:creator>David Bradley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Jul 2008 20:12:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sciencebase.com/science-blog/?p=1708#comment-487167</guid>
		<description>Why keep them separate? If they actually work, then they are physiologically active, and if they&#039;re physiologically active they can have side-effects and contraindications to other drugs and disease states. If they don&#039;t work, then they shouldn&#039;t be being sold in the first place as that&#039;s nothing more than marketing snake oil, surely?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why keep them separate? If they actually work, then they are physiologically active, and if they&#8217;re physiologically active they can have side-effects and contraindications to other drugs and disease states. If they don&#8217;t work, then they shouldn&#8217;t be being sold in the first place as that&#8217;s nothing more than marketing snake oil, surely?</p>
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		<title>By: Mina</title>
		<link>http://www.sciencebase.com/science-blog/unnatural-approach-to-diabetes.html/comment-page-3#comment-486481</link>
		<dc:creator>Mina</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Jul 2008 02:14:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sciencebase.com/science-blog/?p=1708#comment-486481</guid>
		<description>No, please.  I totally disagree with placing mainstream herbals under the &#039;pharma umbrella.&#039;  It&#039;s not to say I don&#039;t support the notion of thorough research, safety, monitoring and accountability, but to compare the vast majority of herbals to pharmaceutical preparations is misguiding and excessive.  I vote stricter regulations but ones that are separate from current pharma protocol/guidelines.

P.S. Speaking of topical aspirin treatments, the &#039;aspirin mask&#039; is a raved about beauty treatment for acne. ;)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No, please.  I totally disagree with placing mainstream herbals under the &#8216;pharma umbrella.&#8217;  It&#8217;s not to say I don&#8217;t support the notion of thorough research, safety, monitoring and accountability, but to compare the vast majority of herbals to pharmaceutical preparations is misguiding and excessive.  I vote stricter regulations but ones that are separate from current pharma protocol/guidelines.</p>
<p>P.S. Speaking of topical aspirin treatments, the &#8216;aspirin mask&#8217; is a raved about beauty treatment for acne. ;)</p>
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